Well, that solves that. Thanks Larry! Note that I'm not seeing the feedback replies with the questions, I only found your reply by loading the activity feed. Weird-apparently it's a firefox (20.0.1) issue (just me?), it works with IE.
Hey Everyone! I stopped and spoke to the residents here during my foreclosure prevention project in NoCo. The story I was told is that the slumvestor owner, who apparently purchased the building in the tax auction 3 years ago, collected rent, never paid the taxes and it appears the building has been foreclosed. Have been attempting to contact a couple of the community housing groups for advice with no success.
Some of the issues the residents mentioned were leaks, electrical, and plumbing, certainly not unusual for a building of this age, but it's a nice looking building on a good street on the east side of NoCo.
My position is that the residents should cease paying rent IMMEDIATELY because Wayne County is the new owner, and at a minimum it will allow them to save some money to find a better place. Any suggestions regarding this course of action?
Ideally, the residents could pool their money and purchase the building themselves, but it also may be an opportunity for someone to pick up a building with residents and cash flow that could be an opportunity for a quality investor.
Incorrect photo. 3312 is actually the third house North of Ash as shown on the map above. The house in the photo above is at the corner of Ash and Harrison. Shows the correct house when you select the Google map link.
Did the slumvestor renege then Darin? I wonder if you could make a deal with the County, might be worth a shot contacting someone at the treasurer's office, or presumably the Detroit Land Bank who will be receiving the leftovers from the fall auction...
Just stopped to check on and feed my Pet Block yesterday, however, it looks like it's going to be the site of the *NEW IMPROVED* customs plaza and border processing facility.
...and the individual fortunate enough to pony up the money to purchase an old service station will also then inherit the environmental liability that may run into the hundreds of thousands of dollars.
Anyone considering the purchase of any property in the city should do thorough research on its history and use, and be certain to look for potential site of contamination: former industrial, gas stations, dry cleaners, etc.. For example, the Metropolitan building was occupied by jewelers and had to have a remediation done to clean the building of radiation from the radium used in watches. Buyer beware!
You nailed it Larry. Just caught that earlier and wanted to note it because launch day is tomorrow. Thanks!
No hit on the forfeiture list. When you click on the bright yellow or burnt umber properties on the "Tax Distress" layer, it will show "delinquent" or "subject to foreclosure" respectively on the little popup window that shows the address. When you click thru to the property detail page (with the photo and property details), then select the "I want to pay my taxes online" link (REALLY AWESOME) and search by address, the WCT site matches what's shown on the popup.
Checked another couple properties in the neighborhood, both delinquent and subject to imminent foreclosure, but the same message: "This property is at risk of tax foreclosure. If late taxes are not addressed by March 31, 2013, it will be foreclosed and owned by Wayne County." appears on the property detail page regardless of extent of delinquency. This could really freak out people who owe 2011 or 2012 taxes and whose property won't go to foreclosure for another year or two.
Just a small detail to fix, but this new data layer will be INVALUABLE for neighborhoods who want to be proactive and help out their neighbors prior to d-day on 3.31 avoid both the substantial administrative fees and surprise pre/post-auction discoveries that they're being auctioned out of their property. Thanks to you all for this really important enhancement!
Hmmmm, interesting. This has been bugging me for a few days, wondering what happened here. My guess is perhaps the map is incorrect? 30 mins left-somebody play lotto and buy it for $500 and see what happens.
Caveat: this may be a grey area. My call is get over there during the day, secure the house thoroughly, put up no trespass signs, and hope for the best. I think it's almost better not to engage the neighbor until after the squatter has been discouraged and moved on.
Wow, this is an object lesson in the dark side of the auction process. Sorry to hear about this Graves, it has to be a nightmare.
Service of process is the predicate to legally consummating the foreclosure action, as I recall, which is where I would start. I know of circumstances where the process server simply signs the affidavit as the homeowner or attests that they delivered the paperwork when they didn't. If it was done by certified mail, they must have record of a signature or delivery. Chase down those details-if service was improper, they must unwind the deal.
If you can make a deal with the investor and put a couple hundred dollars in their pocket (if you have to) to get the house back, that is obviously the best solution, and will save you money.
I've been talking about getting a group discussion together next week to bring attention to issues just like yours and generate some media coverage. Would love to speak to you directly about your situation. Contact: firstname.lastname@example.org if you want to participate.
This just salved the wound of my auction loss and made my day. Thanks, Jerry ;)
Citi, your predictive powers are truly awesome. Perhaps a WDWOT? psychic hotline for next year? Could be a real benefit to the community for planning purposes... Congrats to the bidders, hope you can play let's make a deal and save the building!
One comment to Detroiter: Didn't mean to presume that your Mom or the neighbor were gambling, but was just pointing out that has occurred frequently in the past; It has to be incredibly frustrating that they didn't look for help until it was too late. This story has played out far too many times in the city.
After auction chaos has died down next week, I suggest we get a group together and create a plan to confront the city and county about this problem. I think this is one of the important stories that needs to be told, and the media has so far failed miserably in that mission.
Contact me at: email@example.com
First, I do sympathize with your neighbor's and your family's situation, Detroiter. It's heartbreaking. It really illustrates the daily financial struggle of Detroit families that continue to be pushed out of the city because of the extraordinary high taxes and lack of services provided in return.
This is a classic example of residents paying for decades of disinvestment, watching their taxes get higher and higher to support a government that refused to accept the reality of their plummeting tax base and refuses to make any effort to address the most obvious and fundamental issue in Detroit.
WDWOT? is philosophically about transforming the conversation about Detroit land use on a macro scale, pointing out the absurdity of auctioning properties in this manner and ultimately asking the question: Why Aren't We Land Banking?
On a micro scale, the invaluable nature of the site makes the auction accessible to everyone, allowing someone with a plan to identify a lot or home to buy and rehab, live in, rent out, create a garden or park. Other LoveLand tools bring more transparency, allowing you to determine who owns the land around you, or identify the slumvestor who isn't maintaining their property in your neighborhood. Yes, it also makes it easier to speculate, but Jerry is only bringing sunshine to a crazy, dark world designed by inept politicians as a phony solution to this core problem.
In the end, however, this is a question about your personal situation, and how WDWOT? has impacted it. If you take the position that your family and neighbors have been operating in the shadows, not paying property taxes then repurchasing their homes at the $500 auction to save money, then I'm sorry-that's just gambling, and a foolhardy gamble at that. I do understand why they took the gamble, though.
The question does illustrate the larger problem of affordability and fairness. Is it fair that longtime Detroit stakeholders are being pushed out of their homes because of backbreaking taxes? Is it fair to those paying their taxes, while living in homes with declining value or in declining neighborhoods with no services because so many people don’t pay? Is it good public policy to offer 12 yr tax breaks to new developments that attract new residents, and will they stay when the taxes skyrocket at the end of the deal?
I don't know your personal situation, Detroiter, or that of your neighbor's, but if the property assessments are too high, then challenge them in March. If that fails, go to the tax tribunal. Ask for a hardship reduction. Talk to the city. Confront city council. Don’t just wait for the tax sale, then pray you can keep your home. Get out there and start talking about this with your neighbors and make the politicians listen.
This question also raises a fundamental issue of social justice-is it good public policy to kick people out of their homes for not paying the extraordinary high tax bill, then only collect 10% of the taxes owed after kicking them out and contributing to the death spiral? What percentage of the city budget does the $250 million left on the table after the auction represent? If the city and county are simply abandoning this money each and every year, why not just reduce property tax bills by a corresponding $250 million on a progressive schedule that gives bigger breaks to those who need them most?
I’m certain Jerry agrees that simply dumping 5% of the city to auction each year is bad public policy, but the importance of this site is to generate questions such as this and get people talking about effective solutions.
Probably not, unless there is some clear fraud or mistake on the part of the County, which is possible (probable?) See 3111 Trumbell as an example of a disaster in the making. Thank Amy Swift's diligent work for getting that fiasco settled and the 'property that was no longer a property but a retired master deed' pulled.
But, if you bought a burned out house or a vacant lot that had a pic of a house on the googlesat, then you are out of luck. Do the due diligence if you feel there is some mistake, then speak to an attorney if you make a case.
*** FAIL! *** Well, neighbors-I took a stab at it. Tried to play beat the clock and missed my window after someone outbid my opener. Hopefully it's someone from the community that picked it up, as I'd hate to see it was just another auction troll slumvestor...
Cheers and good luck!
Soooo, it's crazy to bid on these units, right? It's all about control, vision, energy, and potential. Let's assume nobody is going to bid, including the other owners. Pay $1500 for all 3, and you've bought 3 years to work out the details, challenge the assessments, put together the deals for the other units and move forward.
Crazy? Certainly. A guaranteed home run? This is Detroit-chances of success: low. An important historical and community project? Absolutely. Try to make a run at it if you want to work like hell and make a difference.
Ultimately, just looking at throwing $1500 away (if you can afford to throw $1500 away) isn't as bad as seeing the units turned into yet another vacant lot.
Well, we should have been down trolling for TV coverage with WDWOT.COM signs, but that boat just sailed. Not to say all the opportunities with the national media streaming in for the series should be missed. Any vacant buildings in the vicinity of the stadium we could post on? Guerrilla banner hanging? Little colorful wood box houses art pcs. placed around the 'entertainment district' with "$500 houses for sale" and "WDWOT?" stenciled on them?
Just saw the comment regarding hexavalent chromium at 216/226 down the street, so I'd do some environmental research before committing...
I was speaking to someone yesterday about it, so looked it over today. A bunch of tires, but looks solid (and ugly) I dig the old place next door. Precast concrete roof is a plus. As for the $50k estimate for close-up: sounds high to me. However, this is not a bootstrap project, but definitely worth a thorough look, and a pretty damn good location right next to the new construction and 555. Well, PDG as locations around challenged Detroit communities go...
Yep, still there. Really worth a cruise up LaSalle from the south. Absolutely gorgeous street with Boston-Edison style old mansions. Would love to get a look inside this place betcha much beautiful detail work-all burned up? Hope not...
Yahtzee! Just rolled by a couple hours ago with the place all lit up with spooky halloween decor, so I'm stoked to hear that...
Anyone up for a crowdfunding project to get the remaining taxes current?
Okay...I suspect this should ratchet up the conversation a couple notches. A few thoughts:
First, yes-we live in a capitalist democratic republic and everyone is free to bid on whatever property strikes their fancy. Yes, 2825 looks like a charming little house and is a good drive-by. Jerry and the Loveland team have put together a great community resource to add to the conversation about what to do with all the vacant properties in Detroit. We all clearly see the benefit and greatness of this effort.
Second- citi's comments regarding people asking others not to bid because they have a plan, particularly in this case-where those asking want to assist a sick resident stay in this house, are too cute by half. I applaud anyone who wants to make an altruistic effort to assist a struggling resident, or buy an empty property/lot and improve the built environment. This is the underlying philosophy of WDWOT?, creating a dialog by illustrating that we could purchase 2.5% of the Detroit land mass at this auction for $5 million and create the world's freshest land bank.
Finally- 'citibankmanhattan' is a charmingly ironic pseudonym, and I wish you well on your auction goals, as long as you are interested in actually improving the built environment and not just continuing the decades-long cycle of benign neglectful speculation and slumlording that exacerbates the death spiral. If that is the case, drawing attention to your activities and the expression of general contempt for those seeking to make a difference, particularly if you want to buy a house and kick the old, sick resident to the curb could potentially incite the ire of your new neighbors and lead to direct action. The type where your 'investment' is reduced to smoldering ruin.
I don't want to leave anyone the impression this is a threat, simply an observation that the community ideology underlying the effort to make Detroit better, one property at a time, is a valid and worthwhile effort and more refreshing than the 'every man for himself' ethos that pervades the investment class.
Happened to spy this on Curbed today. Is it still there? May be a deconstruction candidate, but the googlesat shows significant fire damage. Still, a great looking old house near boston-edison...
The article had a link to DetroitYes! on squatting, which may be gone: http://detroit.curbed.com/archives/2011/10/asking-the-detroityes-crazies-how-to-squat-a-house-in-detroit-1.php
Hope that anyone planning to bid takes into consideration those that have expressed interest in saving the property for the benefit of the current resident. Such a charming little place, and it would be a travesty to see it spin out in a speculative death spiral.
...which brings up a question I had as a noob-how does the county know who/what entity to issue the deed to? Which per the terms and conditions, they will send an email to the winning bidder, and you must reply within 24 hours with the deed information. Otherwise the deed will be issued in the name of the winning bidder (whatever info you submitted to Wayne County) Ex: I signed up under my name, but will register the deed to my corp.
I applied for option 'b', or the $535 deposit. In the event I fail to win my preferred property, I may yet find something else to submit a bid on. If I don't, I'm willing to proxy. Prob should have pooled resources with 9 others to allow more flexibility.
I would advise anyone interested in bidding to verify this info at Wayne County. It appears that the corner building is a match, and I googled a commercial listing showing the corner building at that address. A much better appearing structure than this turd that is likely destined for the wrecking ball, which would add value to the adjacent structures.
The loss of Patterson Terrace would be yet another tragic loss to the Brush Park community. Note that the entire complex has been split into condos, and I think someone mentioned last week that the Kappas may own the others that are not at the auction. The unfortunate history of the Kappas benign neglect of other homes in the area (note the recent demo of 2 kappa houses nearby) could be the greatest impediment to any positive effort for change. But-never say never. My recollection is that the building was starting a renovation prior to the Republicans destroying the global economy, so there was some momentum.
Considering that foundation money, grants, and crowdfunding are being used around the city (Spaulding, in particular), be aware that it's an incredibly tough slog, but decidedly do-able if you have the iron will, engage the community, and make a long term commitment to see it through. Starting with a historic, significant property such as this makes a great starting point. Talk to the Kappas (or whoever the other owners are), see if you can start a dialogue, and go from there...or just buy them at the auction and move forward to see what happens next.
This property is worth making a try...
As I mentioned last nite, I posted this property in an ad on Craigslist: http://detroit.craigslist.org/wyn/reo/3315975330.html
Any suggestions for improvements to the ad are welcome.
Was thinking I could include a link to this page to expand the conversation, but wanted to clear that with Jerry first.
Cross-posted to: NYC-Manhattan, Boston, San Francisco, and Chicago.
I haven't made any neighborhood drawings yet.